Jay (40:29.423)
Yeah, that's not what I'm saying. I'm just talking about the analogy. You're, you're, yeah, exactly. You're giving up the disease, whatever it is, right? Let's just use the flu, because everyone knows what that is, a live virus, in a way to then train your body, your immune system to be able to fight that. So that, you know, that's the, the science behind that, whether it be COVID or
Daniel (40:32.235)
Right, right, right.
You took a left instead of a right. You were supposed to go, no.
Daniel (40:41.654)
Right, right, live virus.
Jay (40:58.791)
flu or whatever things that people want to, wherever you stand on vaccinations, the, the science behind it is you give a little bit to train your body and your immune system how to fight it. And that's what prevents you from getting more sick is the, is the logic there, the scientific logic. So in training within a real dive and not on a line demonstrating skills that
gives you some of that same live virus, quote unquote, in a safe environment within the context of your instructor. And again, in this case, in 20 feet of water, not actually in a cave, buried somewhere deep, not deep in a cave, but deep. If you're in Florida, most of the caves are deep or whatever, we're in a very safe environment. It gives you that immune response to the problems or the failures that may arise.
or the things that you might face. Now it's not to say that then we don't go into the cave and actually do these things there. That's what cave one and cave two is about, but in the introduction to it in overhead protocols, or for example, when we're doing a tech one dive, I mean, Greg and I told this story on the last podcast about, you know, um, you know, the, the Deco bottle getting stolen from Greg, cause Greg and I thought we were smarter than our instructor and we weren't. And, um,
Daniel (42:20.854)
Yeah.
Jay (42:25.423)
But that's a real situation. Those things can come off, it's a lost ego.
Daniel (42:30.192)
He'd make a great pic.
Jay (42:32.607)
Oh, I think so. I think that's where he learned it all.
Daniel (42:34.51)
I mean, assuming he's not already.
Jay (42:36.843)
Yeah, I have to check my safe here since he stayed with me for two weeks. Kidding Ben. Check from all my watches. Yeah. But, uh, you know, that, that's a situation that then we dealt with it. It was like, oh, you don't have a deco bob. At first it was jarring. And then after we dealt with it, it was funny because you're kind of like, geez, yeah, he got us good on that one. But now I know if I want to observe the full diver before you call a deco stop.
Daniel (42:41.138)
right? Thank you for watching.
Jay (43:05.483)
And make sure they have the bottle because we could have caught it a lot earlier. But then two, I have experience in saying, if this ever happened in real life, how do we react to it? It's the same thing, you know, in now over, or, you know, in a lost line, how you react to it, I mean, hopefully the surge isn't throwing you everywhere, but eventually I figured it out. Eventually I figured out how to talk. And if I had another five minutes, I probably would have found the line. Right. And you just cut, cut the drill because I got the point, right.
So again, the value of real experiences in a safe environment is a lot like giving a little bit of the virus in a safe dose so that your immune response, or in this case, your emergency response to dealing with those things, you know, our bodies know what to do because they've seen it before, same thing becomes true in your scuba training.
our bodies and our minds. That's something that we don't really use when we're fighting a disease is we can't, well, again, we're going to get into the whole thing, but you know, we, we don't fight the disease with our mind, positive thinking, but yeah.
Daniel (44:13.73)
I mean, you can remain positive and it should certainly help it. But then you'll have the mechanical, if that's the right term, if something goes wrong. If you say, all right, this is going wrong, here's the mechanical process in which to fix it. But then there's a variable that could be added into that, like a silt out. So you've got a problem.
you've got an air problem, a gas problem, but now you're in a complete silt out. So you know how to fix it if you could see it, but now you can't see it. So again, the harder you train or, and again, I don't think that's the right word, but the more you train, the more difficult the training, when something happens, then you're just better prepared to deal with it.
Jay (45:00.707)
Yeah. And I think one of the things to that point is, is that there are
At least I've learned there are protocol divers that will react or you can become, let me put it this way, you can become a protocol diver, which is a rote response to a problem, if that makes sense. So you have a protocol to solve the problem and that's it. And one of the things again, I appreciate in the training I've received is the goal is not the protocol. The goal is, is the thinking diver and the thinking team.
Daniel (45:20.714)
Yeah, sure.
Jay (45:37.039)
And so the reaction then becomes about the brain and how we're processing this together, then it, then it does the protocol. And one of the things I appreciated in some of the training I got was look like th there isn't a wrong way to solve the problem. If you get out, there are simply more efficient ways that we can solve problems. So if you decide to do a, a gas share on a fixable right post,
and exit the dive, okay, you got out. You planned for it and your gas plan, great. But more efficient would be, why don't you just fix the right post? Like I do screw in the first stage and you could have continued your dive and instead you spent all that money or whatever effort to get down there.
Daniel (46:23.854)
Well, that lends itself to the control of the emotions and the panic. And if you have enough people, then I would imagine that dynamic is able to, depending on each one's responsibility, is able to solve that problem, right? But if you're diving with a single buddy, and maybe you've dived with this person for years or just...
a lot of dives, but you've never had a problem. You've never come across a situation that required some nuance to your problem solving. And then, you know, you don't know what's gonna happen until it happens. And then that could be, it could be the equivalent of sharing gas and going to the surface. The equivalent could be bolting to the surface because that's just where my brain goes. I'm just gonna go because I know there's air.
my buddy will be okay or whatever the case may be. So the training, and it's hard to train in that situation if you don't have the right, I guess, structure, the right infrastructure for that sort of thing. But I think if you asked every scuba diver a yes or no question regarding training, just make up a question. It'll probably get the same answer because no scuba diver should ever be like, I'm good.
I mean, I'm good. If I dive within this environment, then I don't need any more training. Well, that's not entirely accurate. You know, you should always be, I mean, every dive is a training dive, but if you're diving at 30 feet and going south for 2,000 kicks and coming back, it's like, you know, what's gonna happen? Who are you diving with? The environment might be the same, but you know, maybe you had, I don't know, maybe you had a couple of drinks last night and it's gonna affect your...
reaction on this dive and then anyway a million different scenarios there but I think training is key no matter what.
Jay (48:30.519)
Yeah. And I think being open to, you know, looking at it more as a continuation rather than a checklist in the sense that like, yeah, that's a good way to put it. Yeah. Cause I mean, look, I mean, for me, I've, I've trained technical diving. I've done technical diving. I know how to react to a failure on my twin set.
Daniel (48:41.038)
Hmm. It's a lifestyle, not a diet.
Jay (48:59.503)
But even I need to be put in that situation because I can take a hundred dives on my twin set and nothing goes wrong. And then I get back into training, right? And boom, you go, oh yeah, is it right or left? What do I need to do? And although I know what to do, I haven't done it in a hundred dives because I haven't had that reality. Like when there's a failure in tech, you know, or even in the silver-eyed protocols, there's a, you know, an instructor brings down the air gun.
And you don't see it coming. And all of a sudden you hear the bubbles exactly how it would be. Um, and, and again, you can do as many valve drills as you want and think through those things, but then when the bubbles come, which is something you don't want to go and simulate yourself, like let's break the manifold just so I can make sure I'm trained on this. So it's, so it's a continuation. It's not like check. I know how, what to do. If I hear bubbles on my right side, it's continuing to train those things.
Daniel (49:43.704)
Right.
Jay (49:59.431)
on an ongoing basis and to put yourself in those situations. And yeah, it might be as routine now for me to, which is not, I'm not saying that, but it might be as routine now for me to, to deal with a manifold failure as it would be for me to deploy a backup light, for example. Um, but it's still something I should be doing in part of the training. And some of that stuff, you, you just, I can, I can simulate a light failure all day long and deploy a backup light and deploy a second one.
Um, and that's easy enough to do, but, but simulating bubbles coming out, uh, of, of which side and making a guess it's a little harder for, for that. And so I look at it as, you know, no matter where, where you are in your diving or wherever I am in my diving, wherever I think I am, it kind of comes back to the. The immutable truth of scuba diving is as soon as you feel like you're on the high horse, get ready for the fall. And that's.
that's a lifestyle choice to continue to put yourself in the situation to feel the fall and not, not get, I think Gareth Locke talks about, uh, I don't know if he talks about it in the same way, but the, the idea being risk homeostasis where, yeah, you do the same 30 foot, 60 foot dive or man, if you're tech diver, you do the same, you know, 200 foot dip on the same boat, uh, every month. And it gets comfortable.
to the point where you are normalizing the risky things that you might be doing. When you change the environment or you change the conditions, or you change the visibility, which are part of the conditions, so on and so forth. Now you're dealing with something that, that presents a different risk. And it's not just the dip in Lake Travis and swim, you know, say hi to Jim, the rock and Fran, the rock and the other rock that you know, you know, you want to be able to
train for those situations that again, we're in the wild. And that's the thing with
Daniel (51:57.119)
I feel like it seems odd that if you do the same dive for a year, once a week, in your mind you think theoretically people will think or do think nothing's gonna happen because nothing happened the last time, the last five times. But in reality, it should absolutely be the other way around. You're just getting closer and closer. Like if you never get your reg set.
Jay (52:16.045)
Exactly.
Daniel (52:25.562)
serviced it should be closer and closer to it failing. So I don't know why we it's weird that we think that oh it didn't happen last time it's not going to happen this time.
Jay (52:36.279)
Yeah, like equipment or buddy checks in, um, I think is what a lot of, yeah, that's the prime example in my mind. There are so many things that can be solved in an equipment match and prevent it, yeah, before you ever hit the water. That the fact that, that those get skipped over because I'm an event is a case in point to what you're saying is the, the more and more we normalize.
Daniel (52:40.082)
Oh yeah, you're fine. You look good. We're good. Let's go.
Daniel (52:49.858)
prevented. Yeah.
Jay (53:05.511)
the fact that we didn't do a buddy check last time and no one died. Therefore we don't need to do a buddy check this time because no one will die. Right. It's kind of the, the logical logic behind it all is exactly what you're saying. You're hurtling closer and closer towards the sun. Like you're going to get burned. Like that's, I was actually coaching one of my students in, we ran an essentials of tech course, um, Ben and I co-taught that and you know, we were getting into the weeds.
Daniel (53:20.875)
Yeah.
Jay (53:33.987)
with this particular student about, um, waiting. And it's an easy place to get into the weeds because, um, you know, you start to know when you, when you go through some of the training that we're doing, you actually know that when you're a pound or two light, it's crazy, but you, you know that and you actually learn. Like the exact waiting for your, you know, undergarments or your, your wetsuit, whatever you're diving in the exact way we measure, right? What is your rig actually way underwater? We.
use a fish scale and measure it, right? And so she was kind of going down the rabbit hole of down to the pound. And I said, look, like I get it, but that's a really good like thing to think about, but it's also like chasing the white dragon or whatever, the whatever the phrase is, right? Is that like, look conditions, you know, did you eat a big meal last night? You know, like you have a little more bioprene maybe that today or, you know, did you...
Daniel (54:22.072)
Hahaha
Jay (54:32.355)
you know, is it colder? Are you did you change undergarments? Are you diving the same twin set? Or is it you know, you switched to aluminum's right?
Daniel (54:38.014)
or back to the bomb topic. You haven't dropped any bombs yet, no. Ha ha ha.
Jay (54:43.095)
Yeah, you haven't released, uh, in a while. You haven't, you haven't, your B 52 hasn't been out of the, out of the hanger yet. Um, you know, whatever. So, so waiting is going to be variable, you know, salt water, yeah, and whatever, 35, whatever. Like, I mean, it changes, it shifts. And so like, you want to be within a range. We know our lungs are about four pounds. We can, we can deal with on a shift with our lungs.
Daniel (54:58.199)
Yeah, sure.
Jay (55:11.163)
So we want to have a range. Now, if you dive in the same place, a hundred dives every year, yeah, you should know you're waiting for that spot. But if I'm on a boat, I'm going to take the first dive and go like, ooh, I feel a couple of pounds light. Let me throw a couple more pounds on, right? I want to be within that range. I said, but the things to obsess over are the things that there are no variables to. An equipment check or a buddy check, there is no variable. You either do it or you don't.
And that's something to obsess over and to be obsessive about, right? And doing it the same way over and over again, so that it becomes something that you are disciplined in doing gas planning. We can't change the amount of gas we have under the water. I mean, I guess we can if we've staged bottles and things, but, but if we'd haven't done gas planning and we're not clear about is this a half usable, all usable thirds usable situation and what rock bottom is
Which in our, in my language, rock bottom is enough gas to, to take two divers to the surface or to the next available gas source in a, in a no gas available situation, that's something that, that there is no variable to really, unless the dive plan gets completely screwed at some point for whatever reason, and then we're able to do that recalculation or water as a team. So those are things to obsess over is the things that, that are. Um,
I think that are relatable back to that risk homeostasis, which is to say, not normalizing things that are super simple that we skip that turn out to be super risky.
Daniel (56:53.846)
Yeah. So what's next?
Jay (56:58.199)
Yeah. So a lot of, a lot of topics in this one. This is a good, a good, a good one. Yeah. So for me, I'm, I'm super happy. So I passed overhead protocols, which is really kind of a pass fail. It's not a certification, but it's a prereq class. So I'm cleared for the next step. And so after DEMA this year, which is in, I think I already mentioned is in New Orleans, we're going to go down to.
Florida and excited about hubbing out of out of Cape country there. And we are going to do cave one and cave two, which is if, yeah, if you look at UTD standards, uh, cave one is really the only, I think it is the only course that has a time limit on it in terms of like, if you're certified cave one and expires, that's the only one that expires.
Daniel (57:38.851)
Both of them.
Daniel (57:50.734)
interesting.
Daniel (57:54.466)
Oh, oh, not the course itself, like a test, okay.
Jay (57:56.495)
No, no, it's an expiring certification. And the reason that cave one is even in the standards from what I understand is because it's taking into account if like a hurricane comes through and we can't finish full cave or something like that, at least you can get into the environment and practice. And so it's a rare certification. So cave two is full cave, full navigation within the cave, no decompression and obviously not a rebreather yet in the cave.
But that's cave two is full cave. And so the way that it's done is cave one, cave two are combined, or I forget how many days, five or six days in the environment. And so that will be November.
Daniel (58:41.912)
What is the course with full cave and decompression?
Jay (58:47.099)
Um, I have to look it up off the top of my head. I couldn't tell you. I think that, um, cave two introduces, um,
I'd have to look it up. I think it introduces either.
Jay (59:06.579)
I don't think it introduces decompression, but it introduces, I think, stages. I have to look it up. I don't remember. I don't know off the top of my head, but yeah, KF2. So, that's one part of my, and so by the end of the year, again, if fall things go according to plan in terms of my performance and, you know, I'm not a whole lot of risk, I think, in that part of the country for that time of the year of not being able to finish because of the environment.
Daniel (59:14.83)
No, I'm just curious. Just curious.
Jay (59:35.727)
Then at the end of this year, I will have, I will have achieved my first scuba goal, which was to become a certified cave diver. And I'm pretty excited about that.
Daniel (59:46.69)
a year and at least six months in advance based on your original plan, yeah. Awesome, man. Oh, okay.
Jay (59:50.659)
at least six months in advance of them.
Yeah. And then I have one other
So the other is there is a, and we'll see how this all plays out. But the other thing that I've been moving towards, so my first goal in diving was after I was in Atzenote was to get CAVE certified and to be able to be in that environment. And as time has progressed in that, my ultimate goal has been to explore. I wanna get to a place where I can.
explore and I've done some of that. Um, but certainly not to the extent that I would like to. And the idea with exploration is that there are lots of tools available to you. And you want to be able to utilize the tool that is best suited for that job. So whether that be, you know, single tank, you know, back mount doubles, doubles and you know, stages, decompression diving, cave, whatever it would be.
That my skillset and my ability to use these tools wouldn't hamper the explorations, whatever the exploration needs, I can utilize that tool. That's been kind of the, the putting tools in my backpack view of, of my training and, and all that. So one of those tools that has become extremely relevant to me now that I'm in San Diego and have done some diving here has been, Hey, like there's some
Jay (01:01:25.059)
really interesting things that are deep here and gas and, and gas mixing now become limitations to being able to see what those things are to explore those things down there or what I'm not exploring, like it's never been seen before, but exploring for myself. And so there are a lot of applications here that a rebreather makes sense, um, as the tool to use to go and make those types of dives.
Daniel (01:01:53.79)
Is, sorry to interrupt the flow. Does Jack dive re-read? Okay, I think I thought I remember that.
Jay (01:01:58.863)
He does. I believe he is on a, he told me, I don't wanna misspeak for him, but I think he's on a kiss sidewinder, if I believe. Or he's on a kiss rebreather and he's configured for backbounce, I don't remember. But yeah, some of these other folks, which is that I've dealt with are also on rebreather, whether rebos or other. And so one, I have people that I can die with and two, there are,
Daniel (01:02:07.296)
know this one.
Jay (01:02:27.687)
clear applications for that tool here. That would be super interesting to me. So anyway, in the long story short, there is a maybe or a likelihood, put it that way, that training could also take place early December after Cave. We'll see if that's gonna be the case and there's a lot of logistics to work out.
Daniel (01:02:35.626)
Yeah, for sure.
Jay (01:02:57.207)
on that, but I'm kind of settling in on, and I'm sure we're going to get a ton of comments on this. So feel free to leave me your opinion. I'm taking it all into account right now, but so far in my research and things, I've really been drawn to the SF2, the Scubaforce SF2 Re-Breather back-mounted. There's also a configuration to convert that into a side mount unit if needed.
Daniel (01:03:06.626)
I'm out.
Jay (01:03:24.611)
And I just really love the simplicity of that unit and what it kind of looks like. And this is why I'm saying there's going to be a thousand comments of everyone has their opinion.
Daniel (01:03:33.935)
I was thinking.
Daniel (01:03:38.274)
and I might edit this comment out.
Jay (01:03:39.943)
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
Daniel (01:03:42.254)
But maybe you could wear the SF2 shirt every episode.
Jay (01:03:46.027)
Yes, yes, that's I'll call them to get that. Um, yes, I'll wear that one or my, uh, my, uh, my light monkey shirt when I eventually get it someday. But yeah, so that, that's an, a possibility as well, which is. Again, all these things were not in my plans for 2023. I literally thought, and I still, you know, my ultimate plan is to get established here and that's how.
Daniel (01:03:49.346)
Ha ha ha.
Daniel (01:03:57.587)
Oh yeah, well that, yeah.
Awesome.
Daniel (01:04:10.262)
Well, shoot, man, then what's happening in 2024?
Jay (01:04:14.863)
dive, man. One of my applications for rebreather diving is I mentioned it on the Desert Island Dives, not the archeology edition, but the other one, which is the big O and the swim through in the hangar bay, the riscany. So that's a perfect application for a rebreather because for many reasons, but that would be a good one.
Daniel (01:04:30.143)
Oh. Yeah.
Daniel (01:04:37.814)
Well, if you don't take video, you will have to go back.
Jay (01:04:42.999)
Yeah, there you go. Exactly. Yeah. Oh, and then the highlight too, I forgot to mention the highlight from these last two weeks, um, which was super fun during our essentials course that I was instructing on the last day, we were doing some more dives together, um, and we decided to go to La Jolla Cove. And, um, right now it's, well, it's always the case that there are sea lions and seals there.
Daniel (01:05:08.58)
Oh, yeah, I saw the video. That's.
Jay (01:05:09.911)
Yeah, but right now there's a lot of, uh, they're pumping as well, or the pups are out. And so we got to take, uh, you know, some, a lot of fun diving with the sea lions and.
Daniel (01:05:24.495)
Did you notice that, I mean, are moms protective of their pups?
Jay (01:05:31.063)
It's hard to read, like I was asking actually, one of the buddies I made is a lifeguard. I think he's a lieutenant or some high up in a lifeguard about that and how to read their reactions. Cause they're.
Daniel (01:05:47.374)
Because that one video came right at you, snapped and then left.
Jay (01:05:50.615)
Yeah. So, so, so some people read that when you see that video as they see the bubbles and they're blowing bubbles along with you, other people, and the way I read that video was a get the heck out of my space.
Daniel (01:06:04.302)
It looked like a false charge. I mean, it looked like a bear false charge. Yeah.
Jay (01:06:06.807)
Yeah, like get out of here. Yeah, like that's how I read it. And I fully didn't expect, yeah, yeah. So I mean, you know, it's a wild animal. So, you know, you don't know. And we weren't like, yeah. And you actually see this. I mean, it's wild, but no, we were in a respectful, like we didn't go chasing them. We let them kind of, when we saw them, let them...
Daniel (01:06:11.182)
That's probably the safer way to read it.
Daniel (01:06:20.862)
Oh, you mean I shouldn't go up to it and take a selfie right next to something that's a thousand pounds? Jeez.
Jay (01:06:36.699)
have their space and try to capture. I have some other video I have to share, which is beautiful of them in their own space playing and things. But then there's lots of stories of the divers have here of the sea lions coming and pulling on their fins and being playful and this thing. So, you know, you don't know. And it kind of comes back to the whole thing of like, better safe than sorry. And so with all marine life and all aquatic life, take pictures.
Um, don't put your hands on, uh, don't, you know, go chasing, chasing something and it's in its home environment. Um, that makes it feel threatened. I tell my girls all the time, you know, if you, if you leave something alone and give it space and it's going to do the same to you and, you know, all that. And, um, but yeah, that video that we got a bunch of them, but that one in particular that you're mentioning, I read that as like, don't you're not welcome here.
Daniel (01:07:34.306)
Yep. Yeah.
Jay (01:07:36.207)
but others saw it and said, oh, they're blowing bubbles because they see your bubbles. And these are experienced, so I don't know, but I'll tell you what I didn't do was go and chase that sea lion afterwards. Oh, I know they must just be behind us being like, look at this idiot. You know, they're so graceful in the water. So super highlight. And if you're out there and you're wanting to dive with sea lions here in San Diego, I'm happy to jump in the water with you.
Daniel (01:07:46.702)
Good luck. Good luck in keeping up with him.
Daniel (01:07:52.563)
Yeah, internet.
Jay (01:08:04.643)
If you make that journey or you live here, um, it's, it's an awesome experience. It really was. Cause I mean, they're everywhere and beautiful kelp forest, uh, around that side of the Cove and really nice diving. The visibility on that particular day was pretty good. We got in another day. Um, you know, a few days later and visibility had just gone to, you know, bad. Um, so it depends on the day, but yeah.
Daniel (01:08:24.843)
on that.
Daniel (01:08:29.837)
Cool, man. I'm super excited. And I am going to ask that you share more pictures than you do. How about that? I was going to ask you that while we're not recording, but on the recording, I'm going to say, I need more pictures.
Jay (01:08:37.608)
Yeah, that's a good, that's a good, that's a good.
Jay (01:08:45.435)
I know, I know. I'm trying, I really am. And I actually did post for myself. I did share a lot of posts on Instagram. So for myself, that was a lot, but it definitely wasn't enough. Ha ha ha.
Daniel (01:08:49.29)
Ha ha ha!
Yeah.
Daniel (01:08:56.466)
Yeah, well, it's true. Twice a year, I think is what you do. It's about right.
Jay (01:09:00.811)
Yeah, I need to get better at it. So, hey, if you're a social media expert out there and you know, a good regiment to, to get me to train me in that social media environment, um, of how to be more disciplined, I would appreciate a shout out to me and a kick in my rear to get that stuff done.
Daniel (01:09:19.734)
Me too, actually. So we can zoom with that person conference call. Cool, man. I'm really excited to see what happens. I like how 2024 is not happening the way you planned it in a good way. I hope the house is settling in. You're settling into the house, all of the above. So yeah, glad we got this down for posterity.
Jay (01:09:23.011)
Yeah. Exactly.
Jay (01:09:47.719)
That's right. Yeah. And I think maybe it would be fun to do. I think this was your idea to do one when cave one and cave two are over, do a little couple mini series here. It'd be fun.
Daniel (01:09:55.506)
Oh yeah, this is series. We'll, we'll turn this into jade's yellow brick road or maybe the red one. No one knows where the red one goes. Do you see that? There's a, just saying, just saying.
Jay (01:10:03.263)
Yeah, yeah, that's true. I don't know. Yeah. No, I mean, like I said, I'm super blessed and, and surprised that this was even an opportunity this year. And I said, I'm really thankful to my good friend, Kevin Wood as well. Because he's, I took on the planning for OHP and all the things that happened here. This is my home base. But he's taken on all the planning for Cave 1 and Cave 2 in Florida.
And so again, I kind of can ride his coattails on that. And so I, again, if I had to take on all the planning logistics for all that, I probably wouldn't be doing it just because it's, you know, one of those things this year. Um, but the fact that it just dovetails off of DMA, I'm going to be a DMA anyways. Um, you know, it's not too far of a drive down to Florida from there. Like all of it kind of works out. And so I'm thankful to a lot of people who are handling some of the logistics for me to be able to.
Daniel (01:10:41.354)
Yeah, sure.
Jay (01:11:00.411)
to join in and then like I said, if things go well, which I anticipate they will, I don't have any reason to think that they won't, then yeah, then by the end of this year, I'll be full on CAVE certified, which is a goal for sure, but the bigger goal is to dive in the CAVE. So then I'll be allowed to then dive in the CAVEs and that's gonna be make for a fun 2024. And then if the Reader thing comes through as well, then there's something to work towards in terms of.
Daniel (01:11:19.178)
Yeah.
Jay (01:11:29.391)
Being able to bring that unit into an overhead environment, which is more training, so it's not, it's not like you get rebreather and then, Hey, go down some caves now that's rebreather. One is same limits as rec one a hundred feet, you know, open water, no overhead. And so there's training to do on that unit and hours to put on it, to be able to bring in the case so you could see it.
Daniel (01:11:48.094)
I think you did. You did 100 feet, Rec1. You're not supposed to do 100 feet.
Jay (01:11:52.203)
Yeah. What dive five, I think it was like six. Hey, what's down at a hundred feet or a hundred. I think it was 130 was the, and I actually told that story the other day. I won't tell it now, but I told the story where I was like hanging my, my hand down to hit that 130.
Daniel (01:11:58.466)
Let's go. I don't know what you're talking about. No.
Daniel (01:12:09.654)
Oh, oh, I thought it was the, I thought it was the compass fail.
Jay (01:12:15.559)
Oh no, gosh, that was a whole nother situation, but that wasn't deep. That was, that was just, no, we were, we were mid water at like 60 feet and couldn't see anything in vertigo and all the other things kicked in. So, but that's a whole different story. No, the deep one was, was well, yeah, we'll have to tell another story. So the pick on you, but yeah, I remember the first time it was like, Hey, how deep can we go? You're like, yeah, I've been deep in a long time. What's why not?
Daniel (01:12:20.574)
Oh, it wasn't?
Daniel (01:12:26.37)
60p, okay.
Daniel (01:12:32.238)
fun stuff.
Jay (01:12:45.539)
And in my mind, I'm going, oh, well, I'm, I'm with a dive master. Like, you know, I'm, I'm fully safe. And we did. And then there was like, I think there was another buddy separation. And I remember hanging my hand down. No, no, we lost some other guy who ended up, we lose, we lost him a lot, not because we lost him because he would just peel off and do his own thing. And then.
Daniel (01:12:45.651)
Yeah, let's go.
Daniel (01:12:49.366)
Yeah.
Daniel (01:12:57.994)
Not from me though. Not from me, not from me that time. Yeah. No, because.
Daniel (01:13:12.071)
Oh yeah.
Jay (01:13:13.547)
I remember his name now, but I'm not going to mention on the podcast, but there was a guy. Yeah, there was a guy. Anyway, long story short, yeah, I remember like getting down to 130 feet on air and hanging my watch down to get it as deep as possible just to like show it on my, you know, my computer and just, you know, no narc out, but just kind of, okay, that was fun for five minutes and now.
Daniel (01:13:16.65)
No, that's fine. You tell me afterwards. I'm vaguely. Yeah.
Daniel (01:13:26.399)
Yeah.
Daniel (01:13:42.654)
No, I mean, I remember a line. There was a line there. Wasn't the line go all the way down or? Yeah.
Jay (01:13:43.183)
We have enough gas.
Jay (01:13:47.319)
Yeah, there was a buoy that a line went, well a line went down to another line that went down to another line that took us all the way down. Yeah. But anyway.
Daniel (01:13:52.594)
Yeah, right. Yeah. So. All right, man. Well, great catching up. I love you on the podcast. I can't wait for the next episode.
Jay (01:14:02.323)
Yes. Yeah. And looking ahead, so we have the final episode with Greg coming up, which I think is going to be great. And then we've got three with Kevin Wood. So he'll come onto the show, which is exciting. And learn a little bit about some of the similarities, maybe between B-52 training and Scuba. And we have a ton of stories because we've dove a ton together and been in a lot of these trainings together. So it'll be fun, hopefully fun episodes. And then
Daniel (01:14:21.698)
It's boring day job, yep.
Jay (01:14:32.251)
Ben Boss will actually be back on the show as well at some point. We're gonna talk about designing trainings for adults, which is gonna be interesting amongst other things. We don't know. Well, we know we have a couple more of this series of cave and then we don't know what's gonna happen because we haven't invited any other guest co-hosts.
Daniel (01:14:41.838)
And then after that, who knows?
Daniel (01:14:55.106)
We know.
I think we know what we want to have.
Jay (01:15:00.527)
Yes, but we're not ready to talk about that yet. Yeah, so it's been a weird season two. I can't wait to do a season two recap and just talk about how this season has been a very challenging and very rewarding season at the same time. But yeah, it is.
Daniel (01:15:02.886)
No, we are not.
Daniel (01:15:10.752)
Mm.
Daniel (01:15:16.978)
and interesting, yeah. Sure. Lot of practice, it's good practice. Every episode is a training episode. Ha ha ha.
Jay (01:15:29.423)
That is not the situation you want to be in as a podcast, but I think that actually is true, has been true this season, which has been great. What's cool about this season, I think so far has been there's been so many different voices. You hear the passion from all of these folks in different areas.
Daniel (01:15:33.624)
No, but it's true.
Yeah, of course it is, yeah. Learn something new.
Jay (01:15:56.363)
And I know for myself, I've learned a lot and, um, not only about diving and about those interests, but about divers and, and those, how those paths, uh, how they gone down their path and things. And so that's been a really cool thing. And it was actually, it's crazy. I didn't tell you the story, but, uh, we were at a dive shop getting gas fills and, um, the guy behind the counter and there was just chatting with them.
So, what's your story? Like, what are you working on? He's like, oh, you know, my ultimate goal is to be an underwater archeologist. I kid you not. Those are the words that came out of his mouth. And I probably look like such a fool because I was like, no, bleep. You're kidding, I'm gonna stop. You're kidding me. Like, I like yelling at this poor dude. He's, you know, just graduated, got his master's. He's like, why is this guy yelling? And I was so excited because I'm like, oh, we just finished these two episodes with you gotta meet this guy, Greg, blah, blah. I'll introduce you guys.
Daniel (01:16:32.692)
Interesting.
Daniel (01:16:42.19)
It's like, what?
Jay (01:16:52.407)
And we started talking about the stories and all that. And so, um, I'm bummed I haven't heard from, so you're listening to this episode, dude from ocean enterprises. I forgot your name already. Why haven't you reached out? Number one and number two, I know where you work. So I'm going to come and say hi to you. Um, but I want to introduce him and Greg and hopefully he's listened to some of the episodes because it was crazy.
Daniel (01:17:11.63)
I love Greg's definition of underwater archaeology. Do you remember from the episode? He's like, well, basically everything you do in archaeology, underwater. And it caught you off guard for a second. It was a funny moment. I think it's clipped. I think I clipped it out there. Yeah. So hey, I got to run. I've got a 3 a.m. flight. So can you take us out?
Jay (01:17:17.303)
Yeah. Yeah, it's like.
Jay (01:17:24.216)
Yeah.
Jay (01:17:30.42)
Hahaha
Jay (01:17:35.267)
Yeah, it's a long episode.
Jay (01:17:40.855)
Yeah, let's wrap this baby up. So again, out there in the skewiverse, thanks for joining us. Hopefully this was interesting to you, but a good idea from producer Daniel here. And if you would like to connect with us, please do. You can go to thedivetable.com and send us a message. We love hearing from you and love hearing your thoughts, especially I'm imagining I'm gonna get a thousand Re-Reader emails now about why they're, and virus comments, yeah.
Daniel (01:18:07.479)
And virus comments too. Yeah
Jay (01:18:10.967)
I did not say I was an anti-vaxxer or for vaccines. I just explained the science, but I'm sure I'm going to get emails. Uh, but reach out to us. Um, the, the dive table.com also, if you are interested in learning more about the training that I've been on or the training that I provide as an instructor, uh, you can go to Gardner underwater.com. It's Gardner underwater.com and reach out to me there or wherever. I love to talk about that stuff.
Daniel (01:18:13.066)
Nope. Yeah, fuck.
Jay (01:18:39.123)
And as always, we are a production of Fish Dive Surf, Inc. And so if you want to learn more about waterway conservation and the connection between fishing, diving, and surfing, go to fishdivesurfinc.com and you can reach out to Daniel. Oh, sorry, fishdivesurf.com. The Inc is implied, it's silent. The Inc is pronounced.
Daniel (01:18:55.47)
That's justfishdivesurf.com. That's all.
Daniel (01:19:02.724)
The ink is permanent.
Jay (01:19:08.591)
with nothing, just fishdivesurf.com. Yes, fishdivesurf.com. So please reach out, we'd love to hear from you. We'd love to hear what your journey's looking like. What surprised you? I have a ton of surprises this year. And I'm sure we'll hear from lots of you. And maybe we should, you know, to read some of these on air. We'll get some and read them on air, that'd be fun. Yeah, so thanks for joining us for this episode, and we hope you come back for the next episode of The Dive Table.
